On the first day of this year’s Democratic National Convention (DNC), I was scrolling Facebook when a news story caught my eye: “Former MAGA Republican Rich Logis slated to speak at DNC.” What struck me about the headline was that I had worked with a guy named Rich Logis years ago. In fact, he was still one of my Facebook connections. As far as I knew, however, my friend Rich Logis was running a small business in Florida and had nothing to do with politics. Half assuming the story was targeted clickbait, I clicked on it anyway.
Shockingly, the story was indeed about my old friend. Logis had been an active MAGA pundit and Trump campaign volunteer until 2022, when he became disillusioned with both Donald Trump and Florida Governor Ron Desantis and decided to “switch sides.”
He did it in a very public way: by penning op-eds in several major publications, one of which caught the attention of former Representative Adam Kinzinger, Republican of Illinois. Kinzinger, who endorsed Kamala Harris and is currently campaigning against Trump, was also a speaker at the DNC. The two exchanged messages on X, and Kinzinger put Logis in touch with top Democratic campaign staffers. Logis, feeling bold, asked to speak at the DNC to get his message out. The staffers suggested he assemble a video for consideration.
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In the DNC video, which played on the first night of the convention and runs just a little more than a minute long, Logis directs his comments to Republicans and independents and rails at Trump’s lack of leadership during the pandemic, his divisiveness, and his ongoing mendacity.
“Lying is Trump’s toxic superpower,” he declares. Since the video aired, Logis has found himself caught up in the whirlwind of national politics, keeping up a busy speaking schedule, occasionally appearing on major news networks. While he has received mostly kudos from the left, he has been the subject of wild rumors on the right.
Now a co-chair of “Republicans for Harris” in Florida, Logis also launched a nonprofit called Leaving MAGA, which he envisions as a community for former Trump supporters like himself. He also just finalized a partnership with MeidasTouch Network, for which he will interview ex-MAGA members.
I caught up with Logis on a recent video call, and we dug deeper into why MAGA appeals so strongly to some, and why it’s important to offer a compassionate way out to those who want to leave.
Q: Tell me about your political background and what drew you to Trump.
Rich Logis: For years, I believed that our two major political parties were basically the same, that our political system did not represent everyone. Many Americans felt unseen, unheard, and unrecognized, and I shared that sense. I voted for Ralph Nader several times. Fast forward to 2015, when, having interviewed Trump for business stories [for Gannett-owned papers in New York], I decided to take a hard look at him. I found myself nodding in agreement to his comments about corruption, about people feeling like the political system failed them, about watching jobs go overseas. I saw Trump as a true outsider who would break the system and rebuild it.
Q: How did you feel about his early divisive and conspiratorial statements, such as the Obama “birther” conspiracy?
Logis: I want to preface my comments by saying I am completely responsible and accountable for what I chose to look away from, and Birtherism is one of those. So much of Trump’s candidacies have been based on what I call the absurd and outlandish. The Birther conspiracy was so absurd that it was laughable. Who would believe that? But people did.
Q: How did you reconcile Trump’s absurd and outlandish claims with what you admired about him?
Logis: I looked away from things like Birtherism because I allowed myself to believe that the alternative was worse, that a win by Hillary Clinton would mean an existential crisis for the country. If Hillary won, I believed, then Democrats would seize power permanently and I’d become an irrelevant citizen in my own country. People around me said that, and I believed it. When you’re so inculcated into that extreme way of thinking, you support almost any alternative. Look at what Trump said about John McCain [that he was a loser]. Privately, I knew that comment was awful. But if the election of Hillary Clinton meant the end of America, as I allowed myself to believe, then what Trump said about McCain or Obama being born in Kenya, as bad as those are, they’re not as bad as the alternative.
Q: It’s always baffled me how smart people could accept an idea like Birtherism.
Logis: People need to understand how extensively MAGA exploits peoples’ fears and concerns. And because someone is susceptible to being influenced doesn’t mean that they’re lacking intelligence or good moral character. That exploitation is all based around emotion. For all the “fuck your feelings” sentiments on the right, everything about MAGA is emotional. Everything. And appealing to emotions is an easier way to persuade people. Again, no one coerced me into my support, people move toward Trump of their own volition. But MAGA has a way of using mythologies to unify people and provide the one thing that will always be at the center of MAGA: community.
Q: You view MAGA as a community?
Logis: No question about it. There was no community around the Bushes, none around Mitt Romney or John McCain. There was not even a community around [Ronald] Reagan. But Donald Trump, yes. But it’s really toxic. Because what unifies MAGA is fighting imaginary enemies, and Kenyan-born communist Muslims, and Nancy Pelosi, and fill in all the blanks. That is what I sunk deeper into after the 2016 election. I was in a constant state of panic and despair. It’s the whole adrenaline-fueled, fight-or-flight, political war against an evil enemy thing. Forget about Democrat or liberal, we were against anyone [who was] not with us. If you were 99 percent with us and 1 percent not with us, you were 0 percent with us. That’s how you think when you’re in an environment that’s insular and traumatizes its adherents.
Q: Let’s talk about your break. When did you start to have doubts?
Logis: After [the Unite the Right rally in] Charlottesville, [Virginia,] I became privately critical. It embarasses me to say this but during the “very fine people” press conference, I was with a Trump staffer from [the state of] Oregon. We discussed crisis management, how after the rally the press would label us all white supremacists. So we focused on damage control instead of the fact that Heather Heyer was killed and dozens of people were injured. And two Virginia State Troopers died in a freak helicopter crash at that rally.
Q: That’s awful. What happened after Charlottesville?
Logis: Well, I never believed the 2020 election was stolen, never thought that COVID-19 was a Chinese bio weapon, never thought the vaccine would kill people. So those were holes in the armor because those were popular views in MAGA. The pandemic was the turning point—Trump and Governor Ron DeSantis’s handling of it—and then January 6, and then the Uvalde [Texas,] shooting. With the pandemic, DeSantis initially did a good job and seemed sensible, someone who would divorce himself from the anti-vaccine and anti-mask hysteria. Instead, he embraced those. I also began to diversify my information sources and gradually moved out of the rightwing echo chamber. It occurred to me that DeSantis was just trying to become another version of Trump.
Q: Your public break came in August 2022 with an article that you called your mea culpa. But it was the DNC video that put you in the public eye. What kind of reactions have you gotten?
Logis: The left, unsurprisingly, has been supportive. But I get plenty of negative comments from the pro-MAGA crowd. The three comments I get the most are: I was never really a Trump voter; I’m a paid Democratic operative; and occasionally that I’m a Democrat PSYOP. But I’m still waiting for all the money I’ve supposedly earned. I could really use it right now. No threats, thankfully, but as “Leaving MAGA” grows that’s something we need to consider.
Q: What is your goal with your website “Leaving MAGA”?
Logis: To offer an alternative community to those who want out. I implore readers not to look at Trump supporters as caricatures but to empathize with them. Try to understand their motivations and where they’re coming from. Because only through dialogue and empathy can we realize the extent of MAGA’s exploitation. “Leaving MAGA” will be a home for those who understand they were duped. It’s okay to acknowledge that. It doesn’t make you a bad person. That’s what I had to admit. But we do have one non-negotiable requirement: You have to take responsibility for your past.
Q: Were you ever paid by the Trump campaign and are you being paid by the Harris campaign now?
Logis: No, [I was] never paid by either campaign.
Q: What are you currently doing for the Harris campaign?
Logis: Appearing in media, mainly—news networks, newspapers, press releases, online events. My value is experiential. I saw up close the kind of havoc that Trump and MAGA have wrought. One reason I accepted the position with “Republicans for Harris” is to make amends. I helped Donald Trump divide this country, pitting loved ones and complete strangers against each other. Now I need to bring people together. One positive has been that people write to me asking how to help them resolve disputes. I get a little emotional when I receive some of those messages because having strangers reach out to me is so unlikely. Everything that is happening in my life right now is unlikely.